http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3?format=rss Tribe.net. Local Connections http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#3658f407-60fd-48aa-9bd5-03fbe59bd404 People, you are mixing Rus and Russia. Belarus derives from Rus, and that's why it has only one S in it. Mon, 08 Dec 2008 02:26:02 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#3658f407-60fd-48aa-9bd5-03fbe59bd404 Woloh 2008-12-08T02:26:02Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#73891ddc-27f9-4a56-9071-2ae8a9260411 Da! Spaseeba! Yech, that looks gross. How about: Да! Спасибо! Крэг Джунович в Аркейта Thu, 08 Mar 2007 04:13:31 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#73891ddc-27f9-4a56-9071-2ae8a9260411 Craig 2007-03-08T04:13:31Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#22c7a77c-d0dc-407f-970a-38cca1973aab yes :) we must assume that Russia has generally treated Ukraine with as much disdain as possible, so it is a good guess. Tue, 06 Mar 2007 20:12:09 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#22c7a77c-d0dc-407f-970a-38cca1973aab sonya 2007-03-06T20:12:09Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#67323069-5b8c-406d-b83c-48b939185a73 Sonyatchka! I've been waiting for your input on this! :-D Thanks so much! You've also answered my long simmering question about the phrase "Tsar of all the Russias." I'd heard the phrase, but didn't really know what it referred to. So I imagine Great Russia is Russia as we think of it, White Russia is Belorus, leaving . . "Little Russia" is, what, Ukraine? Craig in Little Arcata Tue, 06 Mar 2007 19:40:23 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#67323069-5b8c-406d-b83c-48b939185a73 Craig 2007-03-06T19:40:23Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#3e0a516c-d685-4ab2-a0fd-46229489d2b1 Well, what is now Ukraine, Poland, Belorus and parts of Russia were, for centuries, known as Rus', Kievan Rus', or just Ruskaya Zemlya. Linguists arent entirely sure as to the etymology of the word Rus', but it has been posited that it is from the scandinavian word for "rowers". As for why it is called Belorus, it was nicknamed such in the 16th century when the tsar was known as Emperor of All Russias, Great, Little, and White. Tue, 06 Mar 2007 18:57:26 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#3e0a516c-d685-4ab2-a0fd-46229489d2b1 sonya 2007-03-06T18:57:26Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#52e303ca-41f3-4614-80dc-af92bbab8073 Daniel, thanks! Hm. I seem to recall the subtitles to the Eisenstein 30's film, Aleksandr Nevsky referring to "Rus," not "Russia". Craig in Arcata Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:54:56 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#52e303ca-41f3-4614-80dc-af92bbab8073 Craig 2007-02-13T16:54:56Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#75c09f33-b23e-4083-9bf2-3cbaeb3561e4 As far as pronunciation is concerned, it sounds a lot like its East Slavic cousins -- more like Ukrainian than Russian, in that there's no 'g' sound, and the equivalent letter is pronounced like an h. But, then again, there's the distinctly West Slavic-sounding 'u kratkaia,' like the Polish crossed l, that imparts a /w/ sound. Byel- is byel- for white throughout the East Slavic world, as far as I know, and Belarusian historians are fond of pointing out that the concept of Rus' (see Kievan, etc.) as a Slavic polity predates or is distinct from the concept of Rossiya. Whether this is just nationalist fabrication I couldn't say. I've never seen a Russian-language document referring to Byelorossiya anywhere that I can think of, just to Belorusskaia respublika. Tue, 13 Feb 2007 06:27:54 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#75c09f33-b23e-4083-9bf2-3cbaeb3561e4 Daniel 2007-02-13T06:27:54Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#ac5e759c-a912-437e-b4ea-fe669204aff3 I just Googled, and it appears there should be a soft sign (myaki znak) after the final "c". Craig in Arcata Mon, 12 Feb 2007 17:47:29 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#ac5e759c-a912-437e-b4ea-fe669204aff3 Craig 2007-02-12T17:47:29Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#ba1607e4-b000-48ad-bd7e-3e702888d3f1 Jheem: Thanks! Vindication! Craig in Arcata Mon, 12 Feb 2007 17:44:47 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#ba1607e4-b000-48ad-bd7e-3e702888d3f1 Craig 2007-02-12T17:44:47Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#b52e5f74-ef71-4b78-8d37-27c59643781b Well, that's my point. If it were standard Russki, wouldn't it be Byalarosiya? I figured the pronunciation was akin to the South Slavic changes, such as in Bulgarian or Serbian, where vowels in Russian are "a' or "ya' turn to "e". I'm sure the two languages are semi-mutually intelligible, like Russian and Ukrainian, but I don't know where the differences lie. Craig in Arcata Mon, 12 Feb 2007 17:44:26 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#b52e5f74-ef71-4b78-8d37-27c59643781b Craig 2007-02-12T17:44:26Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#2a2f3522-a6af-4c49-bc12-4fac2f7b62d4 Not quite true -- Belarus (cyrillic Беларус) is the Belarusian term... the long form is Belaruskaia Respublika) the Russians call/ed it Belorus, or Belorusskaia Respublika. The CIA, for what it's worth, now uses Belarusian, as distinct from the old Russian/Soviet term Belorussian. Mon, 12 Feb 2007 17:36:44 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#2a2f3522-a6af-4c49-bc12-4fac2f7b62d4 Daniel 2007-02-12T17:36:44Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#b5d2ff07-00a6-42aa-ae1a-f7d812eadc89 Belarus is the russian name, meaning roughly White Russia. Since the "russia" is modified it is "rus". "Russia" is not called "Russia" in Russian in teh same way. Bellarussian is what i've always heard Fri, 09 Feb 2007 19:50:34 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#b5d2ff07-00a6-42aa-ae1a-f7d812eadc89 Kip 2007-02-09T19:50:34Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#88ec1d5a-20d6-4356-86e3-5d52401c234d http://www.bartleby.com/61/72/B0167275.html Fri, 09 Feb 2007 17:55:02 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#88ec1d5a-20d6-4356-86e3-5d52401c234d jheem 2007-02-09T17:55:02Z http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#512077e0-2f36-4350-98eb-a342bb1a5c42 Comrades: How do you pronounce the adjective from Belarus? I don't know enough of the linguistic differences between Belaruski (I'm guessing) and Russian, but since the country is called Belarus and not Belarussia or byalarosiya, I'm guessing I should call the language Belarusian, pronouncing is "bell-ah-ROO-see-uhn." Sonya, are you out there? Craig in Arcata Fri, 09 Feb 2007 17:46:26 GMT http://linguistica.tribe.net/thread/fc83dd56-341e-4afe-8232-c1da00a8c9d3#512077e0-2f36-4350-98eb-a342bb1a5c42 Craig 2007-02-09T17:46:26Z